Hi All,
this page http://squeakvm.org/index.html is woefully out of date and misleading. We could at least provide accurate information about the Spur 32-bit and 64-bit releases, and the SqueakJS VM alongside the older VMs couldn't we? Shouldn't we?
_,,,^..^,,,_ best, Eliot
On 16-04-2018, at 12:27 PM, Eliot Miranda eliot.miranda@gmail.com wrote:
Hi All,
this page http://squeakvm.org/index.html is woefully out of date and misleading.
On 22-11-2016 Dave pointed out that Ian has given him keys to that set of pages.
We could at least provide accurate information about the Spur 32-bit and 64-bit releases, and the SqueakJS VM alongside the older VMs couldn't we? Shouldn't we?
We should, we could, and to be honest I'd prefer to see squeakvm.org divert to a VM page on squeak.org Having two sites with conflicting info is insane.
tim -- tim Rowledge; tim@rowledge.org; http://www.rowledge.org/tim atheism: not a religion, more a personal relationship with reality.
On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 12:49:07PM -0700, tim Rowledge wrote:
On 16-04-2018, at 12:27 PM, Eliot Miranda eliot.miranda@gmail.com wrote:
Hi All,
this page http://squeakvm.org/index.html is woefully out of date and misleading.On 22-11-2016 Dave pointed out that Ian has given him keys to that set of pages.
We could at least provide accurate information about the Spur 32-bit and 64-bit releases, and the SqueakJS VM alongside the older VMs couldn't we? Shouldn't we?
We should, we could, and to be honest I'd prefer to see squeakvm.org divert to a VM page on squeak.org Having two sites with conflicting info is insane.
I have sudo permissions on the squeakvm.org server, but I don't manage the web site or home page. I think the appropriate thing is to suggest some changes and ask Ian Piumarta (the site owner) to make an update.
I am attaching a copy of the index.html for the squeakvm.org home page. It's pretty simple, so if someone would like to edit and improve, we can send that back to Ian for the update. In addition to sudo access, I also have his email account in Japan (which he prefers to keep private and separate from his gmail account), so I can forward any updates to that mail address as well (I have the feeling that a lot of mail to his gmail account goes unnoticed).
Dave
On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:57 PM, David T. Lewis lewis@mail.msen.com wrote:
On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 12:49:07PM -0700, tim Rowledge wrote:
On 16-04-2018, at 12:27 PM, Eliot Miranda eliot.miranda@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi All,
this page http://squeakvm.org/index.html is woefully out of dateand misleading.
On 22-11-2016 Dave pointed out that Ian has given him keys to that set
of pages.
We could at least provide accurate information about the Spur 32-bit
and 64-bit releases, and the SqueakJS VM alongside the older VMs couldn't we? Shouldn't we?
We should, we could, and to be honest I'd prefer to see squeakvm.org
divert to a VM page on squeak.org Having two sites with conflicting info is insane.
I have sudo permissions on the squeakvm.org server, but I don't manage the web site or home page. I think the appropriate thing is to suggest some changes and ask Ian Piumarta (the site owner) to make an update.
I am attaching a copy of the index.html for the squeakvm.org home page. It's pretty simple, so if someone would like to edit and improve, we can send that back to Ian for the update. In addition to sudo access, I also have his email account in Japan (which he prefers to keep private and separate from his gmail account), so I can forward any updates to that mail address as well (I have the feeling that a lot of mail to his gmail account goes unnoticed).
Dave
How about changing OpenSmalltalkVM.org home page to have more description and then have Ian forward www.squeakvm.org to there instead. Or just add a link to squeakvm.org pointing users to the new location.
Ron
Ron Teitelbaum wrote
Is it important to keep the squeakvm.org domain to avoid broken links for searchability? If so, since Ian no longer seems to be active in our community, it might be worthwhile to transfer the domain now if he is willing…
----- Cheers, Sean -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Squeak-VM-f104410.html
On Tuesday 17 April 2018 06:27 AM, David T. Lewis wrote:
I have sudo permissions on the squeakvm.org server, but I don't manage the web site or home page. I think the appropriate thing is to suggest some changes and ask Ian Piumarta (the site owner) to make an update.
Wouldn't it be easier if squeak related directories in squeakvm.org is mirrored in squeak.org (say in under v3vm/ directory) for now and then gradually cross-linked into other pages on squeak.org?
Regards .. Subbu
On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 12:27:56PM -0700, Eliot Miranda wrote:
Hi All,
this page http://squeakvm.org/index.html is woefully out of date andmisleading. We could at least provide accurate information about the Spur 32-bit and 64-bit releases, and the SqueakJS VM alongside the older VMs couldn't we? Shouldn't we?
Would something like this make sense?
Save the attached index.html and view it in a web browser.
Dave
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 05:33 AM, David T. Lewis wrote:
Would something like this make sense?
Save the attached index.html and view it in a web browser.
I re-ordered the list in reverse chronological order and updated the links. Should this page refer back to Squeak Home?
Draft attached.
Regards .. Subbu
On Wed, Apr 18, 2018 at 11:11 AM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 05:33 AM, David T. Lewis wrote:
Would something like this make sense?
Save the attached index.html and view it in a web browser.
I re-ordered the list in reverse chronological order and updated the links. Should this page refer back to Squeak Home?
Draft attached.
Regards .. Subbu
Maybe also include this link:
http://squeak.org/development/ which is a beautiful page!
Also, I don't see links to http://opensmalltalk.org/ on squeak.org but it's also a nice landing page. Sending people to that page instead of git would be better IMO, it's a nice landing page.
All the best,
Ron
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 09:00 PM, Ron Teitelbaum wrote:
Maybe also include this link:
http://squeak.org/development/ which is a beautiful page!
Also, I don't see links to http://opensmalltalk.org/ on squeak.org http://squeak.org but it's also a nice landing page. Sending people to that page instead of git would be better IMO, it's a nice landing page.
Thanks for the quick feedback. Updated draft attached.
Regards .. Subbu
On Wed, Apr 18, 2018 at 11:47 AM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 09:00 PM, Ron Teitelbaum wrote:
Maybe also include this link:
http://squeak.org/development/ which is a beautiful page!
Also, I don't see links to http://opensmalltalk.org/ on squeak.org < http://squeak.org%3E but it's also a nice landing page. Sending people to that page instead of git would be better IMO, it's a nice landing page.
Thanks for the quick feedback. Updated draft attached.
Regards .. Subbu
Very nice!
On 18 April 2018 at 18:01, Ron Teitelbaum ron@usmedrec.com wrote:
On Wed, Apr 18, 2018 at 11:47 AM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 09:00 PM, Ron Teitelbaum wrote:
Maybe also include this link:
http://squeak.org/development/ which is a beautiful page!
Also, I don't see links to http://opensmalltalk.org/ on squeak.org < http://squeak.org%3E but it's also a nice landing page. Sending people to that page instead of git would be better IMO, it's a nice landing page.
Thanks for the quick feedback. Updated draft attached.
Regards .. Subbu
Very nice!
Btw, squeak.org is managed on github. Anyone can open a pull request:
https://github.com/squeak-smalltalk/squeak.org
- Bert -
Hi Subbu,
On Wed, Apr 18, 2018 at 8:47 AM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 09:00 PM, Ron Teitelbaum wrote:
Maybe also include this link:
http://squeak.org/development/ which is a beautiful page!
Also, I don't see links to http://opensmalltalk.org/ on squeak.org < http://squeak.org%3E but it's also a nice landing page. Sending people to that page instead of git would be better IMO, it's a nice landing page.
Thanks for the quick feedback. Updated draft attached.
Can we please lose the "experimental"? The distinction is between stable and tip, or stable and development. Back when Spur was being developed it was an experiment. Now it is a stable VM under development. The same goes for the Cog V3 VM.
Regards .. Subbu
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 11:32 PM, Eliot Miranda wrote:
Hi Subbu,
Can we please lose the "experimental"? The distinction is between stable and tip, or stable and development. Back when Spur was being developed it was an experiment. Now it is a stable VM under development. The same goes for the Cog V3 VM.
How about this version? The page needs to be brief (but accurate) and redirect any viewers to the main site where more detail may be presented.
Regards .. Subbu
Not sure if everyone agrees but fwiw,
Latest virtual machines used in Squeak v3 and newer versions
Might be better stated as
Spur, Cog, Stack and Squeak v3 virtual machines.
The suggestion is because not everyone knows what a V3 virtual machine is. IMO the purpose of this page is to get people to the latest Spur VM and therefore it should be the first thing mentioned.
We might [also | instead] add a small description at the bottom
* "v3" is the original object representation for Squeak as described in the <a href='http://ftp.squeak.org/docs/OOPSLA.Squeak.html'>back-to-the-future</a> paper
All the best,
Ron
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 2:17 AM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 11:32 PM, Eliot Miranda wrote:
Hi Subbu,
Can we please lose the "experimental"? The distinction is between stable
and tip, or stable and development. Back when Spur was being developed it was an experiment. Now it is a stable VM under development. The same goes for the Cog V3 VM.
How about this version? The page needs to be brief (but accurate) and redirect any viewers to the main site where more detail may be presented.
Regards .. Subbu
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 7:01 AM, Ron Teitelbaum ron@usmedrec.com wrote:
Not sure if everyone agrees but fwiw,
Latest virtual machines used in Squeak v3 and newer versions
Might be better stated as
Spur, Cog, Stack and Squeak v3 virtual machines.
And I would add something like "Spur is a new object representation for images introduced in 2016 that is now used in current Squeak, Pharo and Cuis releases."
The suggestion is because not everyone knows what a V3 virtual machine is. IMO the purpose of this page is to get people to the latest Spur VM and therefore it should be the first thing mentioned.
We might [also | instead] add a small description at the bottom
- "v3" is the original object representation for Squeak as described in
the <a href='http://ftp.squeak.org/docs/OOPSLA.Squeak.html'>back-to-the-future</a> paper
+1.
All the best,
Ron
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 2:17 AM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Wednesday 18 April 2018 11:32 PM, Eliot Miranda wrote:
Hi Subbu,
Can we please lose the "experimental"? The distinction is between stable
and tip, or stable and development. Back when Spur was being developed it was an experiment. Now it is a stable VM under development. The same goes for the Cog V3 VM.
How about this version? The page needs to be brief (but accurate) and redirect any viewers to the main site where more detail may be presented.
Regards .. Subbu
On Friday 20 April 2018 07:31 PM, Ron Teitelbaum wrote:
Not sure if everyone agrees but fwiw,
Latest virtual machines used in Squeak v3 and newer versions
Might be better stated as
Spur, Cog, Stack and Squeak v3 virtual machines.
Thank all of you for your quick feedback. Original request was for minor updates to squeakvm home page that redirects visitors to the Squeak home page. So I kept the edits to the minimum expecting clarifications to be handled in Squeak developers page.
I didn't expect "v3" to sow further confusion ;-). I really meant "3.x".
I will defer further edits to dtl to wrap up this thread.
Regards .. Subbu
On Sat, Apr 21, 2018 at 04:04:57PM +0530, K K Subbu wrote:
I will defer further edits to dtl to wrap up this thread.
Please - I am not responsible for the squeakvm.org home page, and I will not personally be making any changes to it. That should be Ian Piumarta (piumart at gmail dot com).
My $0.02: Some updates to the squeakvm.org page are certainly in order, but much of what is being discussed in this thread can and should be maintained on the squeak.org and opensmalltalk.org sites.
My own suggestion for a very limited update to the squeakvm.org page was in an earlier reply on this thread.
Dave
On 22 April 2018 at 06:12, David T. Lewis lewis@mail.msen.com wrote:
On Sat, Apr 21, 2018 at 04:04:57PM +0530, K K Subbu wrote:
I will defer further edits to dtl to wrap up this thread.
Please - I am not responsible for the squeakvm.org home page, and I will not personally be making any changes to it. That should be Ian Piumarta (piumart at gmail dot com).
My $0.02: Some updates to the squeakvm.org page are certainly in order, but much of what is being discussed in this thread can and should be maintained on the squeak.org and opensmalltalk.org sites.
And of course, here is the repo for the latter. I'm sure contributions would be welcome. https://github.com/OpenSmalltalk/opensmalltalk.github.io
(although that doesn't deal with fixing the older info)
cheers -ben
My own suggestion for a very limited update to the squeakvm.org page was in an earlier reply on this thread.
Dave
On Sunday 22 April 2018 03:42 AM, David T. Lewis wrote:
Please - I am not responsible for the squeakvm.org home page, and I will not personally be making any changes to it. That should be Ian Piumarta (piumart at gmail dot com).
..
My own suggestion for a very limited update to the squeakvm.org page was in an earlier reply on this thread.
I emailed the suggested changes to Ian and he promptly updated his web page. Thanks Ian!
Regards .. Subbu
Thanks Ian and Subbu and everyone else. This is much much better! The only things I would change would be
- to replace "Portable" with "Portable (pure interpreter, no JIT)", and - replace the first link (http://squeakvm.org/index.html) with a link to http://squeak.org/development/#virtual-machines.
On Sun, Apr 22, 2018 at 9:35 PM, K K Subbu kksubbu.ml@gmail.com wrote:
On Sunday 22 April 2018 03:42 AM, David T. Lewis wrote:
Please - I am not responsible for the squeakvm.org home page, and I will not personally be making any changes to it. That should be Ian Piumarta (piumart at gmail dot com).
..
My own suggestion for a very limited update to the squeakvm.org page was in an earlier reply on this thread.
I emailed the suggested changes to Ian and he promptly updated his web page. Thanks Ian!
Regards .. Subbu
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