Squeak-dev July 2007

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140 participants
214 discussions

Re: Re: [OT, Q] Architecture for Message Broadcasting
by "S.J.Chun" 04 Jul '07

04 Jul '07

Hi, Thank you very much for your all answers. As I said in my previous mail, I cannot assume that I can use multicast/broadcast support because there's some routers which do not support these features. It seems that my original idea - though TCP part could be replaced by UDP for efficiency - might be my last choice. My current idea is that all clients are connected to the server and between clients and server, single byte data (kind of ping) is exchanged periodically and if the clients received some new data is received to the server, then client fetched the data and display. Any client can post new data to the server through another transport(maybe TCP for this case?). I think this kind of application will be helpful for broadcasting messages to the people(like flashmob :-) Thank you again. ----- Original Message ----- From: Joshua Gargus <schwa(a)fastmail.us> To: johnmci(a)smalltalkconsulting.com, The general-purpose Squeak developers list <squeak-dev(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: 07-07-04 10:13:17 Subject: Re: Re: [OT, Q] Architecture for Message Broadcasting Various versions of Croquet have used UDP broadcast for LAN discovery. I haven't heard of anyone doing IP multicast in Squeak; as others have noted, support for IP multicast is not widespread on the internet at large. We might be wandering away from solving S.J.Chun's real problem. Depending on what he (she?) is trying to accomplish, his original approach may be quite viable. At a very high level of abstraction, a Croquet router could be said to work in that way. Josh On Jul 3, 2007, at 5:25 PM, John M McIntosh wrote: > Technically support for this is in various unix flavors (osx) of > the VM. I think. > You might need to set some TCP/IP options to exploit via the socket > plugin prim interface > for setting options. > > On the other hand I've not heard of anyone using it to confirm it > works. > Can not speak for windows, no idea how XP would treat this or if > support in the windows VM socket code. > > In both cases you would need to cross check the source code. > > On Jul 3, 2007, at 1:40 PM, Frank Shearar wrote: > >> J J's referring to sending UDP to multicast addresses. Basically, >> interested >> parties signal (say, through the Internet Group Management >> Protocol, IGMP >> (RFC 2236)) that they want to receive data sent to a particular >> multicast >> address (RFC 3171 defines the (PIv4) multicast address range as >> 224.0.0.0 to >> 239.255.255.255. Likely you'd be interested in an address in the >> 224.0.0.0/24 block, which is for link local multicast.). Datagrams >> sent to >> that multicast address are duplicated and sent to all the interested >> parties. >> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IP_Multicast is a good starting point >> for >> multicast. >> >> One thing to bear in mind is that any routers between the sender/s >> and >> receiver/s must support multicast. >> >> frank > > -- > ====================================================================== > ===== > John M. McIntosh <johnmci(a)smalltalkconsulting.com> > Corporate Smalltalk Consulting Ltd. http:// > www.smalltalkconsulting.com > ====================================================================== > ===== > > >

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News Team Monthly Report for June 2007
by Ron Teitelbaum 04 Jul '07

04 Jul '07

Hi All, News Team Report for June 2007. Our Highest read article for June: http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/10/ubuntu-founder-mark-shuttleworth-talks-abo ut-croquet/ had over 1000 readers Our article: http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/17/minding-your-business-with-smalltalk-part- 3-of-4/ has reached a total of 2700 readers and is still in our top ten articles. Something that is notable is that we had hits on over 100 articles last month. About 20 were only hit once, but about 40 were hit at least 20 times and 20 were hit more then 50 times. We are getting about 250 hits a day. Our best day in June was 531 readers. We were listed in the list of top blog posts on wordpress a few times. We really could use some new members. If you have an interest in writing articles for weeklysqueak please contact me. Thanks, Ron Teitelbaum Squeak News Team Leader

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haltOnce inactive
by Frank Urbach 03 Jul '07

03 Jul '07

Hi all, is there any reason disable haltOnce and others in Object. In the final 3.9 image I didn't find something in Preferences to influence this. Only the key Smalltalk at: #HaltOnce is absent. For debugging events in UI's this is very usefull I think. Cheers, Frank --- Edelstahlwerke Schmees GmbH Geschäftsleitung Clemens Schmees Sitz D-01796 Pirna Handelsregister Dresden HRB 54 www.schmees.com

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RE: The land of the Mice, a bedtime story
by J J 03 Jul '07

03 Jul '07

> Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2007 13:12:18 +0300> From: siguctua(a)gmail.com> To: squeak-dev(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Subject: Re: The land of the Mice, a bedtime story> > I want to note, that when i first joined IRC, and mailing list i was> surprised, how friendly people here. Strange enough for me. I never> met such friendly and polite community before :)> I wonder, is this some kind of karma of people who dedicate themselves> to smalltalk? :)Could be. If you use most of the mainstream languages, things are so hard to do that it makes people grumpy. :) _________________________________________________________________ Don't get caught with egg on your face. Play Chicktionary! http://club.live.com/chicktionary.aspx?icid=chick_wlmailtextlink

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RE: Fishing for a CS Masters Thesis Topic
by J J 03 Jul '07

03 Jul '07

> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2007 22:40:44 +0300> From: danielv(a)tx.technion.ac.il> To: squeak-dev(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Subject: Re: Fishing for a CS Masters Thesis Topic> > Under languages:Also under languages:What I would personally like to see worked on is having a better language to fill the systems programming roll. Right now everything converges on C/C++. There are higher level languages that are used to systems programming (e.g. Slang), but as far as I know they *all* convert to C. The GCC project has the ability to take an AST directly to convert to machine code, but this is also constrained by what C is capable of.What I would like to see is some other language used for this "portable assembler", but without the assumptions and limitations of C [1]. Instead of deciding that added complexity is the solution (e.g. C++) I would like to see a language that looked to simplicity. Personally, I was thinking of a Lisp language for this roll because Lisp is the only language I am aware of (a useful one anyway) that is actually *simpler* then Smalltalk. I think powerful Lisp macros would also make it possible to build abstractions on top of the very low level primitives so that you don't have to do thinks like do a function call setup unless you didn't like any of the available options.[1] Some of the limitations I was thinking of are things like the stack-based method of doing function calls and the inability to catch overflow, but I'm sure there are even more.Thanks,Jason _________________________________________________________________ Live Earth is coming. Learn more about the hottest summer event - only on MSN. http://liveearth.msn.com?source=msntaglineliveearthwlm

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The Weekly Squeak Summary No. 13: May 6 - Jun 30, 2007
by Michael Haupt 02 Jul '07

02 Jul '07

Dear Squeakers, welcome to the The WeeklySqueakSummary, an irregular traffic-dependent report on what's going on in the world of Squeak based on the WeeklySqueak blog. Highlights of the past weeks: Croquet is actually being employed as a collaboration tool in the development of Ubuntu Linux [8], and Squeak is, apparently, increasingly used in teaching [6,10]. Seaside seems to get some support from Gemstone and Cincom [11]. The Scratch project - a multimedia programming environment for children - has made its new projects web site available [1]. Göran Krampe winkingly tells us a story on the historical development of Squeak [12]. Last but not least, registration is open for the upcoming SqueakFest [13]! The past weeks' news items: [1] Scratch Unleashes New Projects Web Site http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/15/scratch-unleashes-new-projects-web-site/ [2] A new home for the Weekly Squeak http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/16/a-new-home-for-the-weekly-squeak/ [3] Kabluee http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/16/kabluee/ [4] Minding Your Business With Smalltalk (Part 3 of 4) http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/17/minding-your-business-with-smalltalk-part… [5] or Squeak, or something. http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/18/or-squeak-or-something/ [6] Squeak in North Carolina Schools http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/23/squeak-in-north-carolina-schools/ [7] Sophie-Croquet? http://news.squeak.org/2007/05/29/sophie-croquet/ [8] Ubuntu founder Mark Shuttleworth talks about Croquet http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/10/ubuntu-founder-mark-shuttleworth-talks-ab… [9] If you can't take the HEAT! http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/25/if-you-cant-take-the-heat/ [10] Squeak at the Salón de la Educación 2007 http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/25/squeak-at-the-salon-de-la-educacion-2007/ [11] Supporting Seaside, OR Mapping vs. OODBMS http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/28/supporting-seaside-or-mapping-vs-oodbms/ [12] Squeak Tale http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/30/squeak-tale/ [13] SqueakFest '07 - Register Now! http://news.squeak.org/2007/06/30/squeakfest-07-register-now/ You can find this and much more on The WeeklySqueak blog, the newsblog dedicated to the world of Squeak:http://news.squeak.org/ Subscribe to the WeeklySqueak RSS feed: http://news.squeak.org/feed/ Happy squeaking, Michael

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FW: [Squeakland] Please Register for SqueakFest
by Ron Teitelbaum 02 Jul '07

02 Jul '07

From: Kim Rose Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 12:25 PM Greetings, If you plan to attend SqueakFest '07 -- August 1,2 & 3 in Chicago -- please register now! It is most helpful to know the number of attendees in advance to plan for food, giveaways, printed programs, etc., etc. so please do register now. An agenda for the 3 days is now posted on the site. http://imamp.colum.edu/eceim/squeakfest07/index.php Please forward this message to anyone you know that might have interest in attending. See you in Chicago! Kim

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Package Universe Browser morph
by Tim Johnson 02 Jul '07

02 Jul '07

Hello, Using Package Universe Browser in squeak-dev-118. With preference #scrollBarsOnRight disabled, the PackageUniverseBrowser window fails to display correctly. There are no browser panes, no "x" to close window, just the three buttons "install...", "select...", and "update...". Thanks, Tim

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FW: [OT, Q] Architecture for Message Broadcasting
by J J 02 Jul '07

02 Jul '07

Hrm, not sure why this stupid live hotmail wants to send all my messages directly to the sender instead of the list.From: azreal1977(a)hotmail.comTo: herbertkoenig(a)gmx.netSubject: RE: [OT, Q] Architecture for Message BroadcastingDate: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 16:51:38 +0000 > Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 12:38:41 +0200> From: herbertkoenig(a)gmx.net> To: chunsj(a)embian.com; squeak-dev(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Subject: Re: [OT, Q] Architecture for Message Broadcasting> > Hello S.J.Chun,> > Afaik broadcast is one single send and everybody listens.> > IIRC a special broadcasting address is used where everybody listens.> > I never done TCP myself but it feels very wrong to to resend the same> message for each receiver.> > Cheers> > > Herbert mailto:herbertkoenig@gmx.netNo, TCP is a connection based protocol that abstracts a direct connection between one process and another, including automatic retransmit and failure detection. It can only be between two ports, so if you use TCP you will have to send to each client individually. You might take a look at the CORBA standard for the broadcast or subscription (don't remember which) server.If you want to send one message and have everyone hear it then you have to use UDP, which is connectionless. But UDP (User-datagram protocol) doesn't do any of the work for you. If you want reliability you either have to write it yourself or find some protocol on the internet someone wrote that is close to what you want. And note: this does not need any special IP addresses.The "special addresses" that someone mentioned would be multi-cast, but that is an IP level protocol. TCP can not run on it, though UDP can. But as was mentioned, since it is at the IP level it requires help from the routers. If you want to look more into this look up "mbone", an internet multi-cast backbone. And lastly, you could just send to network broadcast addresses, but that isn't a good way to go and you can't anyway unless you know the subnet that each client is on (or they're all on the same).Hope that was helpful,JasonHotmail to go? Get your Hotmail, news, sports and much more! Check out the New MSN Mobile _________________________________________________________________ Play free games, earn tickets, get cool prizes! Join Live Search Club. http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=CLUB_wlmailtextlink

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RemoteFrameBuffer v34 problems
by Tim Johnson 02 Jul '07

02 Jul '07

Hello everyone, I am using RemoteFrameBuffer (SqueakVNC) Client in squeak-dev-118. Oftentimes it will completely lock and I have to do an interrupt. The stack trace seems to indicate that there is a circular loop looking for a "requestor". I am not sure what is calling the requestor in the first place, as this happens even if I am not mousing around in the VNC window. Below is a stack trace. Also, another anomalous behavior: when I use my Mac with the VM set at 32bpp, and connect to my PC (running TightVNC) set at 32bpp, RFB shows the graphics in monochrome. When I set the VM to 16bpp (leaving my Mac at 32bpp) and connect to the PC (still set to 32bpp), it looks fine. What's up with that? Thanks, Tim --- The full stack --- BlockContext>>on:do: RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor RFBScrollPane(Morph)>>requestor TransformMorph(Morph)>>requestor - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - RFBClientMorph(Morph)>>requestor [] in RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor {[^ model requestor]} BlockContext>>on:do: RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor RFBScrollPane(Morph)>>requestor TransformMorph(Morph)>>requestor RFBClientMorph(Morph)>>requestor [] in RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor {[^ model requestor]} BlockContext>>on:do: RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor RFBScrollPane(Morph)>>requestor TransformMorph(Morph)>>requestor RFBClientMorph(Morph)>>requestor [] in RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor {[^ model requestor]} BlockContext>>on:do: RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor RFBScrollPane(Morph)>>requestor TransformMorph(Morph)>>requestor RFBClientMorph(Morph)>>requestor [] in RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor {[^ model requestor]} BlockContext>>on:do: RFBSystemWindow(SystemWindow)>>requestor RFBScrollPane(Morph)>>requestor TransformMorph(Morph)>>requestor RFBClientMorph(Morph)>>requestor ...etc...

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