Tim wrote:
Prim 91 is actually test display depth... we don't
do setting of the cursor position.
That's interesting.
I�m just trying to learn the stuff by reading the code.
What's there was:
primCursorLocPut: aPoint "If the primitive fails, try again with a rounded point." <primitive: 91> ^ self primCursorLocPutAgain: aPoint rounded
It'sa pretty bad bit of UI generally to take the
users
'attention' and drag it somewhere else by force.
I pretty much agree with you. To see what I was trying to do. Get a rectangle ask for the bitmap fill style and then ask (via red menu) to reset the origin (or orientation). The cursor is where the menu item was selected which is usually nowhere near the original origin. So the UI is that the picture changes dramatically to jump the origin to where the cursor now is. It is not to bad for just the origin but the orientation stuff is rather jarring. So I thought that something that leaves them where they are until you move the cursor would be more pleasant. I�ve been experimenting with different things that might do that and following up my curiosity.\
I�ve found many a piece of code in squeak that indicated someone intended for a particular function to work.
I�ve found a curiosity about why it doesn�t and what would make it do so a good learning probe.
And while I�m on the subject of curiosity who are the we of
... we don't do setting of the cursor position.
Who makes the communities standards? What are they? And how do newbies find out about them?
Thanks for starting a lively conversation on this.
With curiosity, --Jerome Peace
__________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! http://my.yahoo.com
Peace Jerome peace_the_dreamer@yahoo.com wrote:
Tim wrote:
Prim 91 is actually test display depth... we don't
do setting of the cursor position.
That's interesting.
It's very old and ought to be removed so as to avoid confusing people.
It'sa pretty bad bit of UI generally to take the
users
'attention' and drag it somewhere else by force.
I pretty much agree with you. To see what I was trying to do. Get a rectangle ask for the bitmap fill style and then ask (via red menu) to reset the origin (or orientation). The cursor is where the menu item was selected which is usually nowhere near the original origin. So the UI is that the picture changes dramatically to jump the origin to where the cursor now is. It is not to bad for just the origin but the orientation stuff is rather jarring. So I thought that something that leaves them where they are until you move the cursor would be more pleasant. Ive been experimenting with different things that might do that and following up my curiosity.\
Interesting problem. Seems to me that you should get a chance to choose the new origin you want rather than it simply jumping to the cursor.
Ive found many a piece of code in squeak that indicated someone intended for a particular function to work.
Ah, you've spotted the real weakspot of Squeak - too much left over crud from unfinished and abandoned experiments and no documentation of intent. Infuriating isn't it?
And while Im on the subject of curiosity who are the we of
... we don't do setting of the cursor position.
Who makes the communities standards? What are they?
Muah-ha-ha! _I_ do! It's me! Bow before me oh feeble earthlings!
Oh, and that Goran character. He pulls the strings via a complex web of blackmail and coercion, drugs and surveilance. All under the control of the Evil Overlord of course.
tim -- Tim Rowledge, tim@sumeru.stanford.edu, http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim The hardness of the butter is proportional to the softness of the bread.
Am 27.01.2005 um 01:38 schrieb Tim Rowledge:
Ah, you've spotted the real weakspot of Squeak - too much left over crud from unfinished and abandoned experiments and no documentation of intent. Infuriating isn't it?
How true.
Anyway, here's what we actually needed: raw mouse delta events, that is, a relative movement of the mouse that should not move the pointer (we hide it anyway) and which is not restricted by the screen extent. This is necessary for 3D navigation where a horizontal mouse movement should result in a 360 degrees or more turn.
Now it would be nice if there was a primitive for this, but we can still emulate it by moving the pointer to its previous location after each mouse move.
Now it would be nice if there was a primitive for this ... ;-)
- Bert -
Bert Freudenberg bert@impara.de wrote:
Anyway, here's what we actually needed: raw mouse delta events, that is, a relative movement of the mouse that should not move the pointer (we hide it anyway) and which is not restricted by the screen extent. This is necessary for 3D navigation where a horizontal mouse movement should result in a 360 degrees or more turn.
I'm puzzled why there's a problem. I assume that the user drags across the desktop (physical that is), picks up the mouse and drags some more... ah, now if the OS imposes some restriction on the range of values available there would be a point where it just butts up against the 'edge' or does something else annoying. And in fact Squeak imposes a 16bit value limit if you use the old primitive mouse point call and it looks like the win32 vm has a 16bit limit in the event stuff.
Interesting problem :-)
tim -- Tim Rowledge, tim@sumeru.stanford.edu, http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim Any program that runs right is obsolete.
Am 28.01.2005 um 00:44 schrieb Tim Rowledge:
Bert Freudenberg bert@impara.de wrote:
Anyway, here's what we actually needed: raw mouse delta events, that is, a relative movement of the mouse that should not move the pointer (we hide it anyway) and which is not restricted by the screen extent. This is necessary for 3D navigation where a horizontal mouse movement should result in a 360 degrees or more turn.
I'm puzzled why there's a problem. I assume that the user drags across the desktop (physical that is), picks up the mouse and drags some more... ah, now if the OS imposes some restriction on the range of values available there would be a point where it just butts up against the 'edge' or does something else annoying. And in fact Squeak imposes a 16bit value limit if you use the old primitive mouse point call and it looks like the win32 vm has a 16bit limit in the event stuff.
Interesting problem :-)
Right on.
The problem is that in common UIs we only get the position of the mouse pointer in a mouse move event. I know for sure in X11 and Windows, I suspect it's the same for OSX, too. When you reach the screen border no events are reported anymore. One has to resort to low-level libraries to access raw mouse data (the XInput extension on X, DirectInput on Windows, ...). I'm not quite sure where to stuff this - maybe a new ExtendedInputPlugin, which might provide access to all user interface devices, similar in spirit to XInput?
- Bert -
I’ve found many a piece of code in squeak that indicated someone intended for a particular function to work.
Ah, you've spotted the real weakspot of Squeak - too much left over crud from unfinished and abandoned experiments and no documentation of intent. Infuriating isn't it?
Oh, so I'm not only one thinking the same. What a warm feeling, thanx Tim ;)
Who makes the communities standards? What are they?
Muah-ha-ha! _I_ do! It's me! Bow before me oh feeble earthlings!
Oh, and that Goran character. He pulls the strings via a complex web of blackmail and coercion, drugs and surveilance. All under the control of the Evil Overlord of course.
Wow, I'm finally getting the picture... :))
Tim Rowledge tim@sumeru.stanford.edu wrote:
Who makes the communities standards? What are they?
Muah-ha-ha! _I_ do! It's me! Bow before me oh feeble earthlings!
Oh, and that Goran character. He pulls the strings via a complex web of blackmail and coercion, drugs and surveilance. All under the control of the Evil Overlord of course.
What?! What do you *mean* "under the control of"? I *am* the Evil Overlord.
Hrmph, Göran
goran.krampe@bluefish.se wrote:
Tim Rowledge tim@sumeru.stanford.edu wrote:
Oh, and that Goran character. He pulls the strings via a complex web of blackmail and coercion, drugs and surveilance. All under the control of the Evil Overlord of course.
What?! What do you *mean* "under the control of"? I *am* the Evil Overlord.
That's not what she told _me_.
tim -- Tim Rowledge, tim@sumeru.stanford.edu, http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim Strange OpCodes: XYZZY: Branch and Play Adventure
squeak-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
Bert Freudenberg -
goran.krampe＠bluefish.se -
Kamil Kukura -
Peace Jerome -
Tim Rowledge