On Wed, Jun 27, 2007 at 09:37:01PM +0000, J J wrote:

Hi all,

As you have probably seen, I see a lot of things I want to see done in Smalltalk, but I don't have time to do any of it. My "eyes are bigger then my stomach" as it were. So it occurred to me today that a possible solution to this problem would be to simply pay to have some of the work done.

So to that end, I would like anyone who would be interested to let me know. I will set up a mailing list for any people would want to be take (or give) projects. I will suggest my project on the list, you can answer me privately (or publicly) with your bids. I will select someone, and publicly announce that it has been filled. After that it depends; we can talk publicly over the list, or use an intermediate like rentacoder [1] to ensure that both sides are safe. That is, I don't want to pay if I can't use the finished product, nor do I want the person doing the work to fear that they may get nothing for it.

Sounds good. I wouldn't be able to accept any projects, but I would like to see what people are up to with various mini-projects. I like mailing lists for their convenience, but a third-party would probably be safer, as you pointed out. The election team used the same strategy, as you may recall.

We can negotiate the different things, time frames, price, features. I mostly only be doing smallish projects. The payouts would probably be on the order of $50 - $100 USD but the projects should be small (and often) as well. And if this catches on, there could be much bigger projects or people may chip in to sweeten some of the more interesting pots.

Some people have expressed concerns about bounties in the past that people might have their feelings hurt if they don't get picked. So I would just like to point out, this has nothing to do with the board or anything else. This is just something I wanted to do. I will choose the person the same way any worker is chosen for a given, i.e. the best fit/price/availability/reputation.

Sounds awesome. Good luck.

The payout will work in the same way it's done on rentacoder: We have a bid off for who will do the job, negotiate the parameters and pick the best overall fit, then you do the work, then when it's finished if I accept you are paid. If I don't accept you can try to bring it up to spec, decide to give up, or ask for an arbitration if you think you have met requirements. In the case of the rentacoder site, the payment money is deposited as soon as I accept a bidder so no one can "take their ball and go home".

I'm a big experimenter so many of the projects may be that you get paid and then never hear anything more (because I decide I don't want to go that way after all). But hopefully the money can soften that blow a little. :)

And lastly, I know Squeak is largely a gift community, and I don't want to upset that. I think it is good that people give things to the community (and I will most likely release everything I pay for). I don't want to create a situation where everyone expects to be paid for everything. This is simply a case that I have not managed to get anyone interested in my ideas by talking, I can't realize them myself (this decade anyway), so my last option is to pay.

Seems reasonable. I don't think this is disruptive; similar things have been done in the past, for example: http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/2653

Sounds great Jason.

I wish we can have hundreds of experimenters with, primary courage and secondary intelligent use of resources, to have initiatives like yours,

all the best in your quest,

Sebastian Sastre

_____

De: squeak-dev-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org [mailto:squeak-dev-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org] En nombre de J J Enviado el: Miércoles, 27 de Junio de 2007 18:37 Para: squeak-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org Asunto: Paying for projects

Hi all,

As you have probably seen, I see a lot of things I want to see done in Smalltalk, but I don't have time to do any of it. My "eyes are bigger then my stomach" as it were. So it occurred to me today that a possible solution to this problem would be to simply pay to have some of the work done.

So to that end, I would like anyone who would be interested to let me know. I will set up a mailing list for any people would want to be take (or give) projects. I will suggest my project on the list, you can answer me privately (or publicly) with your bids. I will select someone, and publicly announce that it has been filled. After that it depends; we can talk publicly over the list, or use an intermediate like rentacoder [1] to ensure that both sides are safe. That is, I don't want to pay if I can't use the finished product, nor do I want the person doing the work to fear that they may get nothing for it.

We can negotiate the different things, time frames, price, features. I mostly only be doing smallish projects. The payouts would probably be on the order of $50 - $100 USD but the projects should be small (and often) as well. And if this catches on, there could be much bigger projects or people may chip in to sweeten some of the more interesting pots.

Some people have expressed concerns about bounties in the past that people might have their feelings hurt if they don't get picked. So I would just like to point out, this has nothing to do with the board or anything else. This is just something I wanted to do. I will choose the person the same way any worker is chosen for a given, i.e. the best fit/price/availability/reputation.

The payout will work in the same way it's done on rentacoder: We have a bid off for who will do the job, negotiate the parameters and pick the best overall fit, then you do the work, then when it's finished if I accept you are paid. If I don't accept you can try to bring it up to spec, decide to give up, or ask for an arbitration if you think you have met requirements. In the case of the rentacoder site, the payment money is deposited as soon as I accept a bidder so no one can "take their ball and go home".

I'm a big experimenter so many of the projects may be that you get paid and then never hear anything more (because I decide I don't want to go that way after all). But hopefully the money can soften that blow a little. :)

And lastly, I know Squeak is largely a gift community, and I don't want to upset that. I think it is good that people give things to the community (and I will most likely release everything I pay for). I don't want to create a situation where everyone expects to be paid for everything. This is simply a case that I have not managed to get anyone interested in my ideas by talking, I can't realize them myself (this decade anyway), so my last option is to pay.

Thanks, Jason

[1] The advantage of using rentacoder as an intermediate is that it's established, and everyone will see the projects so it will be more smalltalk exposure.

_____

Live Earth is coming. Learn more about the hottest summer event - only on MSN. Check it out! http://liveearth.msn.com?source=msntaglineliveearthwlm