Squeak-dev May 2003

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204 participants
710 discussions

modules.sqf.org server (was Re: [BUG] Error loading Squeak Map
by Daniel Vainsencher 30 May '03

30 May '03

Trying to load http://modules.squeakfoundation.org/People/dvf/Packages/SM-Loader.13.cs. gz in a web browser brings *** Proxy Error The proxy server received an invalid response from an upstream server. The proxy server could not handle the request GET /People/dvf/Packages/SM-Loader.13.cs.gz. Reason: Could not connect to remote machine: Connection refused *** Daniel Tim Rowledge <tim(a)sumeru.stanford.edu> wrote: > Derek Brans <brans(a)nerdonawire.com> wrote: > > > When I try to install SM, the loader is unable to get /People/dvf/Packages/SM-Loader.13.cs.gz (see error bellow). > Likewise; you should see the weird errors I get when trying to install > into a 5240 image in a directory which already has a 'sm' subdirectory. > I assume this is related to the moving around done recently by Goran? > > tim > -- > Tim Rowledge, tim(a)sumeru.stanford.edu, http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim > A computer's attention span is only as long as its extension cord.

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Refactoring Browser sar file needed
by Derek Brans 30 May '03

30 May '03

Would someone kindly send me (directly) the sar file for Refactoring Browser. Thank you in advance. Derek Brans Nerd on a Wire Web design that's anything but square http://www.nerdonawire.com mailto: brans(a)nerdonawire.com phone: 604.874.6463 toll-free: 1-877-NERD-ON-A-WIRE

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Re: Object: Identity vs. Environment
by Richard A. O'Keefe 30 May '03

30 May '03

Surely the rule for isFoo methods is simple? There is a method which at some point may have to deal with objects of several different classes (some of which may not be known to the designer at the time of writing). For example, in my XML code, practically everything I do has to cope with - a Symbol (representing an entity reference) - a String (representing parsed character data) - a processing instruction node - an element node (let's not even think about comments or CDATA sections, neither of which should be exposed to structure-based applications). Of these node types, only two are allowed in attribute values. Suppose I want to gather "text" from an element in order to stuff it in an attribute value. I want to write something like attVal := OrderedCollection new. thisNode doAll: [:each | each isTextual ifTrue: [attVal add: each]]. The method #isTextual goes in Symbol, String, PI, and Element. If someone wants to add new node types (such as CDATA, perish the thought), it's their job to add isTextual there too. In this case, it is important NOT to put #isTextual in Object, because if someone adds a new node type, we don't want some default value returned, we want a DNU so that whoever added the new node type is reminded to implement the full protocol that XMl nodes are supposed to have in common. So you ensure that your #isFoo method is defined in all and only the classes you expect to be given. But *some* methods really can be given *anything*, and for those methods it is perfectly legitimate to put the discriminations they need in Object. Note that "is a descendant of some class" is the WRONG notion here; if I made entity references some other class that _had_ a Symbol instead of _being_ a Symbol, there would be no inheritance relation between String and EntityRef. Note that "responds to a protocol" is the WRONG notion here; the important question is not whether #PCDATA and &entity respond to some protocol that other things don't, but whether Attribute will accept them. An alternative would be Attribute class>> accepts: aNode ^aNode class == String class or: [aNode class == Symbol class] but this is precisely the kind of case-statement-on-class which we _don't_ want to have in our code for the old familiar reasons.

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Re: Squid plan
by Anthony Hannan 30 May '03

30 May '03

Hi Jecel, Jecel Assumpcao Jr <jecel(a)merlintec.com> wrote: > Multiple "VMs" are needed if you don't have enough security or if you can't take > advantage of multiple processors. Otherwise I don't see the point. Agreed. I hope Squid can handle both security and multiple processors internally so we won't need multiple instances. > So several [Smalltalk] stacks can live in a single segment? Yes. > We are talking about MMU segments or Squid segments here? Or is > there no difference? Squid segments. Maybe MMU segments can be used to implement them if it would help performance or design (I don't know), but they may be too machine dependent. > How about Eliot Miranda's bytecode-to-bytecode optimization project? Exactly, I'm hoping to use this. > > What about just flushing the mmap in my scheme instead? > Things are being flushed all the time, so a crash will almost certainly > results in a "partial flush". What if I use msync? It forces a write to disk the the address ranges you specify. But I am open to trying your scheme as well (using a write log). We should keep the implementation decision hidden in the Segment module. > In a previous design I had "segment owners", as suggested by Michael. My > policy was: > > - if the owner of a read-only (for others) segment was not currently > logged in the local network, then the segment is replicated > > - if the owner is logged in and tries to access an object, the segment > is moved to his node(s) [(replicas are removed)] > > - if the owner is logged in and another user tries to access and > object, the message is forwarded to the current location of the segment I like it. But I'm leaning towards replicating an object and its free children, not whole segments. I know an object and its free children could actually define a segment, but I am defining a segment more broadly as any cut/region/subgraph of the global object graph. Each segment resides on a specific machine. Instead of segments being magically distributed/replicated, objects are. This allows us to implement the magic in the object domain instead of at a lower-level (another example of moving thing out of the VM and into the image). If we still want to group objects, we can add owner fields to the objects like you are suggesting. > The hard part is knowing when an object can be removed from its segment roots array [(Distributed garbage collection)]. Instead of a single roots array, there is one per outside segment that references it. So each segment knows every other segment that has references to its objects. When an object is no longer referenced locally but is still referenced from the outside it is moved to one of these segments and the others are updated to point to it. If there are no more outside references then it is simply garbage collected. Hence we have distributed garbage collection. > I keep all objects around forever. With no garbage collection, how do you free memory? > > The runtime system is written in Smalltalk and Smalltalk assembly, > > instead of Slang and C. Calls it makes to native libraries are done > > through this C interface. > Ok, but my question was how are the native libraries linked to this? > Dynamically (DLLs and friends)? Yes. The squid C interface will load the referenced library (dll) if not already loaded then call the desired C function. The loadDll function itself will have to be statically linked with the boot module so we can use it. > > > This has a lot in common with some of the stuff I am doing, so we > > > might be able to work together. > > That would be great. I think we should continue this discussion so > > we can agree on the overall design. Do you have any links I should > > check out. > http://www.merlintec.com:8080/software/8 I checked it out. Very interesting. But it seems a little complex to me. Maybe your combining too many concepts (viewpoints, replication, versions) into one (segments). My approach is to do it in layers. Segments first, then replication, then versions, then modules, etc.. All are independent concepts. (I have not talked about replication and versions yet but I will). Cheers, Anthony

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the monopoly of classes
by jan ziak 30 May '03

30 May '03

hi again. i want to ask why must everything in squeak be a subclass of something. do you think it's rational?

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Re: Another object view - (was RE: copy yourself ?)
by Lothar Schenk 30 May '03

30 May '03

John Sarkela wrote: > Our only understanding of and access to reality is a simulation. Period. A simulation of what? Reality? But since _all_ you have access to (as per your premise) is the simulation, how would you be able to know that there is something beyond this simulation, something different from it, on which it is based? -- Lothar "Walk this world with me"

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SM-Loader.13.cs needed
by Derek Brans 30 May '03

30 May '03

I haven't heard anything back from Goran about the SM Loader problem. I'm in great need of the SM-Loader.13.cs file. If somebody could email it to me directly I would be very grateful. That should get me part of the way to having SM in my image. Thanks. Derek Brans Nerd on a Wire Web design that's anything but square http://www.nerdonawire.com mailto: brans(a)nerdonawire.com phone: 604.874.6463 toll-free: 1-877-NERD-ON-A-WIRE

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[BUG][FIX]Browser explain of pooldicts fails
by Tim Rowledge 29 May '03

29 May '03

Trying to 'explain' a pool dictionary in the class definition view of a Browser didn't work. Not because the explain code can't do it but because it kept getting diverted to where it tries to find the string as a temporary variable of the selected method. Obviously one can't have much success in finding the temporaries in a class definition. The problem appears to be in the Browser>selectedMessageName code where #Definition or #Comment could be returned - thus confusing the explain code. So far as I can tell the only deliberate user of this was Browser> annotation which actually didn't need to use it. So I removed it and now explaining pooldicts works and nothing seems to have broken. However, #Definition etc are deeply intertwingled with the browser annotation stuff and although I haven't found anything to fail it may be that a quite different answer is required. Try Smalltalk browseAllCallsOn: #Definition to see some of the uses and consider how MessageSet>isPseudoSelector: is used. Suggestions from somebody that actually knows WTF is supposed to be going on would be helpful tim -- Tim Rowledge, tim(a)sumeru.stanford.edu, http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim Spelling checkers at maximum! Fire!

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Exporting a Squeak Animation
by David Faught 29 May '03

29 May '03

On 29/05/03 03:01, "Bert Freudenberg"<bert at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de> wrote: >On 28/05/03 12:00, "David Faught" <dave_faught at yahoo.com> wrote: > >> I have developed a series of Morphic animations for some data >> analysis that I would like to export to a MS Powerpoint >> presentation. I had thought that I could just define a Form over >> each frame of the animation and write it out to a file (which I >> might still end up doing as individual frame GIF/JPEG files), but it >> appears that Squeak cannot write out the same animation formats that >> it can read in. The formats that I am refering to are animated GIF, >> MPEG, and Flash. >> >> Am I missing something here, or is there some other animation format >> that Squeak can write out that Powerpoint might be able to import? >> >> I have several animations of 80 to 100 frames each, so it would be >> really nice to do this in a fairly automated way. Any suggestions? > >I wrote a GIFWriter that could handle animated GIFs back in 1996. I >just resurrected it, see next post. > >-- Bert Thanks Bert! Unfortunately when I tried this it seems to mess up the color palette. I set the display depth to 8 so that I could use a ColorForm as in: image := ColorForm fromDisplay: (Rectangle origin: (x1@y1) corner: (x2@y2)). writer nextPutImage: image. Does the color screw-up come from the fact that I am using a new ColorForm for each frame? I like the idea of using Squeak to replace Powerpoint, unfortunately I need to put this stuff in Powerpoint to be able to share it with my Squeak-challenged co-workers. I'm going to try to attach 1 of the animations that I made from individual frames out of Squeak so that you can see what it looks like. This was NOT made with Bert's changes, but using "GIF Construction Set". It is a plot of utilization on the Y axis by hour of the week on the X axis. There are 7 vertical grid areas that divide the days of the week. The animation cycles through 86 weeks of data with the most recent week, noted at the bottom, being the strongest color and the previous weeks gradually fading to the background. Whoops, the attachment didn't work because the file is bigger than 3 MB. I'll see if I can find somewhere to upload it and let you know ... __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). http://calendar.yahoo.com

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[Bug] pretty printer does not show up comments when
by Stephane Ducasse 29 May '03

29 May '03

Hi the pretty printer does not show up comments when the comments are the last line of the method. Stef

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