On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:31:39 -0500 David Mitchell david.mitchell@gmail.com wrote:
Have you looked at Maui?
Yes, Maui is beautiful. I have ridden the Hana Road by bicycle four times. Paia is famous for wind surfing.
Oh, that Maui. I am not looking for yet another quirky UI builder. My goal is to teach high school students how to construct simple, focused apps using morphs. In tcl/tk I find list boxes useful building blocks and am supprised not to find any on the Objects tab.
Installing from SqueakMap fails because Maui breaks FileList.
Installing from Montecello fails because what I see looks nothing like what the wiki page describes, and the load generates a long list of warnings.
=-=-=-=-=
On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 12:47:53 -0700 (PDT) Jerome Peace peace_the_dreamer@yahoo.com wrote:
From your description it sounds like you are trying to mimic what a pdf reader does (or what a web page does) with a index table of contents in the left frame and the file contents or page in the right frame. Is that correct?
Yes, but this is a specific example of a more generalized problem.
Assuming you could program it could you mock up the visuals for a page without worring about how it would work dynamically?
Did that. Not on winning path.
The other interesting thing to do is look at a simple browser and see how it works. Usually there is a window which has a model. Inside the window there are components such as pluggalbe lists and pluggable texts holders etc. Something, probably the model suggest how to layout the frames in the window. The various components communicate with each other by announcing changes and listening for update messages.
Sounds like old fashioned Smalltalk. I want students to become productive using Viewers and tiles and scripts. Tearing apart System Browser will come later.
On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 9:31 PM, Gary Dunn osp@aloha.com wrote:
On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:31:39 -0500 David Mitchell david.mitchell@gmail.com wrote:
Have you looked at Maui?
Yes, Maui is beautiful. I have ridden the Hana Road by bicycle four times. Paia is famous for wind surfing.
Oh, that Maui. I am not looking for yet another quirky UI builder. My goal is to teach high school students how to construct simple, focused apps using morphs. In tcl/tk I find list boxes useful building blocks and am supprised not to find any on the Objects tab.
Installing from SqueakMap fails because Maui breaks FileList.
Installing from Montecello fails because what I see looks nothing like what the wiki page describes, and the load generates a long list of warnings.
=-=-=-=-=
On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 12:47:53 -0700 (PDT) Jerome Peace peace_the_dreamer@yahoo.com wrote:
From your description it sounds like you are trying to mimic what a pdf reader does (or what a web page does) with a index table of contents in the left frame and the file contents or page in the right frame. Is that correct?
Yes, but this is a specific example of a more generalized problem.
Assuming you could program it could you mock up the visuals for a page without worring about how it would work dynamically?
Did that. Not on winning path.
The other interesting thing to do is look at a simple browser and see how it works. Usually there is a window which has a model. Inside the window there are components such as pluggalbe lists and pluggable texts holders etc. Something, probably the model suggest how to layout the frames in the window. The various components communicate with each other by announcing changes and listening for update messages.
Sounds like old fashioned Smalltalk. I want students to become productive using Viewers and tiles and scripts. Tearing apart System Browser will come later.
Gary Dunn, Honolulu osp@aloha.com http://openslate.net/ http://e9erust.blogspot.com/ Sent from a Newton 2100 via Mail V _______________________________________________ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
None of the ListMorphs in Squeak are (yet) hooked up to the Etoys system. Initializing them is a little tricky. LazyListMorph can not be used separately, PluggableListMorph and subclasses are the ones to look at.
The component system could be used for what you try to achieve but I think it is broken in the Etoys image. http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/1175
Karl
--- On Fri, 3/26/10, Gary Dunn osp@aloha.com wrote:
From: Gary Dunn osp@aloha.com Subject: Re: [Newbies] Best list box morph To: "Squeak Beginners List" beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org Date: Friday, March 26, 2010, 5:31 PM On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:31:39 -0500 David Mitchell david.mitchell@gmail.com wrote:
Have you looked at Maui?
Yes, Maui is beautiful. I have ridden the Hana Road by bicycle four times. Paia is famous for wind surfing.
:-)
Oh, that Maui. I am not looking for yet another quirky UI builder. My goal is to teach high school students how to construct simple, focused apps using morphs. In tcl/tk I find list boxes useful building blocks and am supprised not to find any on the Objects tab.
Installing from SqueakMap fails because Maui breaks FileList.
Installing from Montecello fails because what I see looks nothing like what the wiki page describes, and the load generates a long list of warnings.
=-=-=-=-=
On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 12:47:53 -0700 (PDT) Jerome Peace peace_the_dreamer@yahoo.com wrote:
From your description it sounds like you are trying to
mimic what a pdf
reader does (or what a web page does) with a index table of contents
in the left frame and
the file contents or page in the right frame. Is that correct?
Yes, but this is a specific example of a more generalized problem.
????
Assuming you could program it could you mock up the
visuals for a page
without worring about how it would work dynamically?
Did that. Not on winning path.
Ummm. The reason I asked was so I could get a look at what you wanted? First rule of trouble shooting is first hand information.
The other interesting thing to do is look at a simple
browser and see how
it works. Usually there is a window which has a model. Inside
the window there are
components such as pluggalbe lists and pluggable texts holders etc.
Something, probably the
model suggest how to layout the frames in the window. The various
components communicate
with each other by announcing changes and listening for update messages.
Sounds like old fashioned Smalltalk. I want students to become productive using Viewers and tiles and scripts. Tearing apart System Browser will come later.
Finding answers comes first. That usually means asking the definitive source what it thinks. Which is why I pointed to the closest example.
I'd like to help but you haven't described what you what sufficently so that I might. Squeak is frustrating in that it will get you nearly close to knowing how to do what you want yet still remain far far away from the precise goal.
There are now several different flavors, each pulling developers away from the old branch. Each with their own specialties. No one can earn an easy living maintaining free software. So often the last thing a user needs will not be there until they create it.
Squeak.org is associated with the fine folks at squeak dev producers of various versions of squeak. VPRI (Alan Kay's company) are most closely associated with Etoys and the fine folks at Squeakland. They are the one's dedicated to the educational use of squeak via etoys. With the winding down of the OLPC project work on Etoys they also are strapped for resources. Pharo is a very vital offshoot community under the direction of Stephane Ducasse. They have the help of Gary Chambers who has spiffied up the Morphic UI. They are dedicated to the "adult" uses of sqeuak (a core useful for web design and univerity level academic exploration.)
All free and all as valuable to your enquiry as their price.
Where do you want to go from here?
Yours in curiosity and service, --Jerome Peace
On 27.03.2010, at 22:22, Jerome Peace wrote:
--- On Fri, 3/26/10, Gary Dunn osp@aloha.com wrote:
From: Gary Dunn osp@aloha.com Subject: Re: [Newbies] Best list box morph To: "Squeak Beginners List" beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org Date: Friday, March 26, 2010, 5:31 PM On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:31:39 -0500 David Mitchell david.mitchell@gmail.com wrote:
Have you looked at Maui?
Yes, Maui is beautiful. I have ridden the Hana Road by bicycle four times. Paia is famous for wind surfing.
:-)
Oh, that Maui. I am not looking for yet another quirky UI builder. My goal is to teach high school students how to construct simple, focused apps using morphs. In tcl/tk I find list boxes useful building blocks and am supprised not to find any on the Objects tab.
Installing from SqueakMap fails because Maui breaks FileList.
Installing from Montecello fails because what I see looks nothing like what the wiki page describes, and the load generates a long list of warnings.
=-=-=-=-=
On Fri, 26 Mar 2010 12:47:53 -0700 (PDT) Jerome Peace peace_the_dreamer@yahoo.com wrote:
From your description it sounds like you are trying to
mimic what a pdf
reader does (or what a web page does) with a index table of contents
in the left frame and
the file contents or page in the right frame. Is that correct?
Yes, but this is a specific example of a more generalized problem.
????
Assuming you could program it could you mock up the
visuals for a page
without worring about how it would work dynamically?
Did that. Not on winning path.
Ummm. The reason I asked was so I could get a look at what you wanted? First rule of trouble shooting is first hand information.
The other interesting thing to do is look at a simple
browser and see how
it works. Usually there is a window which has a model. Inside
the window there are
components such as pluggalbe lists and pluggable texts holders etc.
Something, probably the
model suggest how to layout the frames in the window. The various
components communicate
with each other by announcing changes and listening for update messages.
Sounds like old fashioned Smalltalk. I want students to become productive using Viewers and tiles and scripts. Tearing apart System Browser will come later.
Finding answers comes first. That usually means asking the definitive source what it thinks. Which is why I pointed to the closest example.
I'd like to help but you haven't described what you what sufficently so that I might. Squeak is frustrating in that it will get you nearly close to knowing how to do what you want yet still remain far far away from the precise goal.
There are now several different flavors, each pulling developers away from the old branch. Each with their own specialties. No one can earn an easy living maintaining free software. So often the last thing a user needs will not be there until they create it.
Squeak.org is associated with the fine folks at squeak dev producers of various versions of squeak. VPRI (Alan Kay's company) are most closely associated with Etoys and the fine folks at Squeakland. They are the one's dedicated to the educational use of squeak via etoys. With the winding down of the OLPC project work on Etoys they also are strapped for resources.
While this is almost true, let me point out one correction: VPRI is not involved with Etoys anymore, not as an institution anyway. Etoys is in the hands of the Squeakland community now. Anyone is welcome to help.
- Bert -
Pharo is a very vital offshoot community under the direction of Stephane Ducasse. They have the help of Gary Chambers who has spiffied up the Morphic UI. They are dedicated to the "adult" uses of sqeuak (a core useful for web design and univerity level academic exploration.)
All free and all as valuable to your enquiry as their price.
Where do you want to go from here?
Yours in curiosity and service, --Jerome Peace
Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
Bert Freudenberg -
Gary Dunn -
Jerome Peace -
karl ramberg