Hi all,
Two years ago, I started a project for a Parser library - unfortunately, at this time, I was not aware of the marvels of Squeak, so I wrote it in C#. Now I've resumed that project and feel the classical, un-live development process more cumbersome than ever. I would love to migrate my project to Smalltalk, but I'm worrying how much slower it will be compared to C#, as I am doing some quite CPU-intensive computations (that take even C# several seconds for small instances).
So I'm searching for some meaningful benchmarks to get an idea of the speed losses to expect. The main computations affect composite traversal, deep copying, etc., so I think the workload should mainly address message-sending. I did not found really good benchmarks searching for "(squeak | smalltalk) vs (c# | java) benchmark" (assuming that C# and Java play in about the same league). Can someone give me a few pointers? In short, under what circumstances would you recommend me to port a computation-intensive library to Smalltalk?
Thanks in advance!
Best regards,
Christoph
Hi Christoph
As you did not find a good benchmark I suggest that you design a suite of benchmarks for your own purpose. Use as target the field of application.
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Rosetta_Code
Contains many algorithms for different languages.
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Tree_traversal (unfortunaltely Smalltalk version not implemented yet)
But there are over 200 tasks done in Smalltalk
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Category:Smalltalk
Kind regards Hannes
P.S. Also note that the SistaV1 VM will offer a substantial improvement in performance https://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/676
On 9/25/19, Thiede, Christoph Christoph.Thiede@student.hpi.uni-potsdam.de wrote:
Hi all,
Two years ago, I started a project for a Parser library - unfortunately, at this time, I was not aware of the marvels of Squeak, so I wrote it in C#. Now I've resumed that project and feel the classical, un-live development process more cumbersome than ever. I would love to migrate my project to Smalltalk, but I'm worrying how much slower it will be compared to C#, as I am doing some quite CPU-intensive computations (that take even C# several seconds for small instances).
So I'm searching for some meaningful benchmarks to get an idea of the speed losses to expect. The main computations affect composite traversal, deep copying, etc., so I think the workload should mainly address message-sending. I did not found really good benchmarks searching for "(squeak | smalltalk) vs (c# | java) benchmark" (assuming that C# and Java play in about the same league). Can someone give me a few pointers? In short, under what circumstances would you recommend me to port a computation-intensive library to Smalltalk?
Thanks in advance!
Best regards,
Christoph
Hi Hannes,
thanks for your tips! Rosetta Code is a good idea, I will have a look at this.
How many tests would you say a benchmark should contain for being meaningful? Could you also recommend any other task from this page that suits for message-send-stressing?
I have no experience at all with VMs, yet. Can I already run Squeak on SistaV1 anywhere? Does it affect the overall speed greatly if I am in CommandLine mode only?
Best,
Christoph
________________________________ Von: Beginners beginners-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org im Auftrag von H. Hirzel hannes.hirzel@gmail.com Gesendet: Donnerstag, 26. September 2019 10:32:17 An: A friendly place to get answers to even the most basic questions about Squeak. Betreff: Re: [Newbies] Smalltalk benchmarks for Composite systems?
Hi Christoph
As you did not find a good benchmark I suggest that you design a suite of benchmarks for your own purpose. Use as target the field of application.
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Rosetta_Code
Contains many algorithms for different languages.
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Tree_traversal (unfortunaltely Smalltalk version not implemented yet)
But there are over 200 tasks done in Smalltalk
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Category:Smalltalk
Kind regards Hannes
P.S. Also note that the SistaV1 VM will offer a substantial improvement in performance https://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/676
On 9/25/19, Thiede, Christoph Christoph.Thiede@student.hpi.uni-potsdam.de wrote:
Hi all,
Two years ago, I started a project for a Parser library - unfortunately, at this time, I was not aware of the marvels of Squeak, so I wrote it in C#. Now I've resumed that project and feel the classical, un-live development process more cumbersome than ever. I would love to migrate my project to Smalltalk, but I'm worrying how much slower it will be compared to C#, as I am doing some quite CPU-intensive computations (that take even C# several seconds for small instances).
So I'm searching for some meaningful benchmarks to get an idea of the speed losses to expect. The main computations affect composite traversal, deep copying, etc., so I think the workload should mainly address message-sending. I did not found really good benchmarks searching for "(squeak | smalltalk) vs (c# | java) benchmark" (assuming that C# and Java play in about the same league). Can someone give me a few pointers? In short, under what circumstances would you recommend me to port a computation-intensive library to Smalltalk?
Thanks in advance!
Best regards,
Christoph
_______________________________________________ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
About one month ago I tested a simple loop speed comparing: C, Squeak, Python, Ruby.
C of course is the kind, but that is not really a fair comparison.
Of the others 3, which are comparable languages, Squeak was the fastest.
bye Nicola
On 9/26/19 4:29 AM, Thiede, Christoph wrote:
Hi Hannes, thanks for your tips! Rosetta Code is a good idea, I will have a look at this. How many tests would you say a benchmark should contain for being meaningful? Could you also recommend any other task from this page that suits for message-send-stressing? I have no experience at all with VMs, yet. Can I already run Squeak on SistaV1 anywhere? Does it affect the overall speed greatly if I am in CommandLine mode only? Best, Christoph
*Von:* Beginners beginners-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org im Auftrag von H. Hirzel hannes.hirzel@gmail.com *Gesendet:* Donnerstag, 26. September 2019 10:32:17 *An:* A friendly place to get answers to even the most basic questions about Squeak. *Betreff:* Re: [Newbies] Smalltalk benchmarks for Composite systems? Hi Christoph
As you did not find a good benchmark I suggest that you design a suite of benchmarks for your own purpose. Use as target the field of application.
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Rosetta_Code
Contains many algorithms for different languages.
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Tree_traversal (unfortunaltely Smalltalk version not implemented yet)
But there are over 200 tasks done in Smalltalk
http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Category:Smalltalk
Kind regards Hannes
P.S. Also note that the SistaV1 VM will offer a substantial improvement in performance https://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/676
On 9/25/19, Thiede, Christoph Christoph.Thiede@student.hpi.uni-potsdam.de wrote:
Hi all,
Two years ago, I started a project for a Parser library -
unfortunately, at
this time, I was not aware of the marvels of Squeak, so I wrote it
in C#.
Now I've resumed that project and feel the classical, un-live
development
process more cumbersome than ever. I would love to migrate my project to Smalltalk, but I'm worrying how much slower it will be compared to
C#, as I
am doing some quite CPU-intensive computations (that take even C#
several
seconds for small instances).
So I'm searching for some meaningful benchmarks to get an idea of
the speed
losses to expect. The main computations affect composite traversal, deep copying, etc., so I think the workload should mainly address message-sending. I did not found really good benchmarks searching for "(squeak | smalltalk) vs (c# | java) benchmark" (assuming that C#
and Java
play in about the same league). Can someone give me a few pointers? In short, under what circumstances would you recommend me to port a computation-intensive library to Smalltalk?
Thanks in advance!
Best regards,
Christoph
Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
H. Hirzel -
Nicola Mingotti -
Thiede, Christoph